Scooter runs great but will not start

alex1harv · 02-27-2015, 10:15 PM

My taotao vip future champion 50 will not start. If I can eventually get it to start it runs great and even idles a little bit. It is very difficult to get it to start and it will never start with the kick starter. I've gone through everything. Cleaned the carb. Checked the compression(around 150psi). It also has spark. I don't know what else to do.

bull · 02-28-2015, 03:27 AM

Welcome to the Forum!

Considering most of the USA is in almost a deep freeze, there are a few things you could check:

oil: is the oil too viscous? read the oil thread for guidance. is the oil overfull? either of these will slow cranking speed, which reduces the "ignition charge cycle"

carb: have you changed the idle / pilot jet for cold weather? IOW, increased its size to deliver more fuel during this cold weather. a jet that is cleaned with spray may not be clean enough to flow properly. use a jet cleaning tool that gets the jet completely clean.

cranking: have an adequate "gel battery" that supplies power to spin the starter better than a lead acid design. this aids in the aforementioned "ignition charge cycle". Kick starting a scooter is just too slow and random, it is best using the electric starter. a kick starter IMO is like a spare tire, only used as a last resort

temperature: you will find a thread on cold weather starting, and there is an excellent discussion which you should read.

ignition: tightening the gap from specification a little on your plug could help, but i would only do this as a last resort and only during cold weather

additives: the only additive I have found that offers any help on these 4 stroke scooters is Lucas Top Engine Oil, and it really does work, but only add in the correct ratio - too much or too little is just as bad as none

fuel: regular grade, 87 octane, starts better in cold weather. also fuel goes stale if not used regularly

miscellaneous: use a cover over your scooter if it sits outside, and try to start it daily. Even not starting for 1 day can increase starting difficulty. it needs to run long enough for the engine temp to stabilize, about 30 minutes in temps below 40F

skyrider · 02-28-2015, 07:45 AM

87 octane on cold?? is that because it burns faster??
Alex, check out cold weather starting
http://www.scootdawg.net/showthread.php?t=54818&page=2

Two excellent suggestions from the post are adding a manual choke and oil warmer, which I just got.
Before the oil warmer, I would put my scoot in the sun, turn the throttle 5 or 6 times to get fuel in(and then some) to get it running. But after starting it one day kept starting it and letting it run every day really helped. I also put Seafoam, one cap, per tank which has kept my carb clean for years running high test and not letting it sit over a week.(Bull, got the oil warmer yesterday and after 30 min without priming it started but didn't choke didn't kick in long, gonna try 1hr with warmer today and see what happens. Its pencil thin, so you shouldn't have to worry about it hitting curbs.

bull · 02-28-2015, 08:06 AM

No, 87 tends to remain a liquid longer aiding in cold weather starting. 91 is excellent warm weather fuel. There is serious debate about whether 91 is needed or not in these GY6 scooters. I use 91 because it makes the engine run smoother and I look at it as cheap insurance against catastrophic damage. If it runs smoother, that is a friction reduction which means more power

With higher octane fuels you can get carbon buildup in some engines, Ford is strongly prone to this. But in others like Audi & Mercedes it rarely happens.

Glad your changes are allowing you to ride more!

savy09 · 02-28-2015, 03:38 PM

Did you try replacing the fuse?

Firehawk989 · 03-05-2015, 09:04 PM

Adjust the valves!

kz1000st · 03-06-2015, 02:50 PM

^^^^^The valves on a 50cc scooter are gapped at .002 inch when new. It doesn't take long for the gap to close up in the first several hundred miles. Eventually it settles in and you're golden for longer periods.

03-05-2015, 09:04 PM	#6
Firehawk989 Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 198	Adjust the valves! __________________ 2005 Yamaha BWS (Zuma) "Garfield" TP Black Trophy 70cc, Giannelli Reverse Pipe, 5g Dr. Pulley Sliders, Delta Clutch with Yellow Springs and Yellow Contra, Malossi Torque Controller, Naraku R-Vent Bell, NCY Adjustable Secondary Sliding Sheave, CF Reeds, Kege Analog Tach, Dual Headlight Mod, N.A. Rear Fender Delete, OEM Short Windshield.
	0

03-06-2015, 02:50 PM	#7
kz1000st Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Hyde Park, NY Posts: 1,058	^^^^^The valves on a 50cc scooter are gapped at .002 inch when new. It doesn't take long for the gap to close up in the first several hundred miles. Eventually it settles in and you're golden for longer periods. __________________ 2008 Eagle Milano 150- 9,679 miles 2009 Honda Rebel 250- 10,434 miles 2009 CF Moto Fashion- 16,023 miles 2009 MC-114 50cc Cub Clone- 4,317 miles twowheeler.yolasite.com/ That's 30,049 China Scootin miles and Counting.
	0

02-28-2015, 03:27 AM	#2
bull Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 257	Welcome to the Forum! Considering most of the USA is in almost a deep freeze, there are a few things you could check: oil: is the oil too viscous? read the oil thread for guidance. is the oil overfull? either of these will slow cranking speed, which reduces the "ignition charge cycle" carb: have you changed the idle / pilot jet for cold weather? IOW, increased its size to deliver more fuel during this cold weather. a jet that is cleaned with spray may not be clean enough to flow properly. use a jet cleaning tool that gets the jet completely clean. cranking: have an adequate "gel battery" that supplies power to spin the starter better than a lead acid design. this aids in the aforementioned "ignition charge cycle". Kick starting a scooter is just too slow and random, it is best using the electric starter. a kick starter IMO is like a spare tire, only used as a last resort temperature: you will find a thread on cold weather starting, and there is an excellent discussion which you should read. ignition: tightening the gap from specification a little on your plug could help, but i would only do this as a last resort and only during cold weather additives: the only additive I have found that offers any help on these 4 stroke scooters is Lucas Top Engine Oil, and it really does work, but only add in the correct ratio - too much or too little is just as bad as none fuel: regular grade, 87 octane, starts better in cold weather. also fuel goes stale if not used regularly miscellaneous: use a cover over your scooter if it sits outside, and try to start it daily. Even not starting for 1 day can increase starting difficulty. it needs to run long enough for the engine temp to stabilize, about 30 minutes in temps below 40F
	0

02-28-2015, 08:06 AM	#4
bull Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 257	No, 87 tends to remain a liquid longer aiding in cold weather starting. 91 is excellent warm weather fuel. There is serious debate about whether 91 is needed or not in these GY6 scooters. I use 91 because it makes the engine run smoother and I look at it as cheap insurance against catastrophic damage. If it runs smoother, that is a friction reduction which means more power With higher octane fuels you can get carbon buildup in some engines, Ford is strongly prone to this. But in others like Audi & Mercedes it rarely happens. Glad your changes are allowing you to ride more!
	0